Curse

Kirbie · Mar 09, 2006, 08:56 AM // 08:56

Base on V-Dragon's post above, I think it would be more proper to bring a poll regarding "your thoughts about 6 character slots".
Loviatar's use of buying or not buying faction poll in this discussion makes this incorrect assumption that all people who are buying factions are 100% happy with 6 character slots.

For my case, I'm not extremely happy with 6 slots. I'm just ok. That doesn't mean I'm gonna go extreme and not going to purchase the game right?
I've had a great fun with GuildWars and I'm pretty sure that Factions will also deliver the same experience I had with the original.

Some people's decision to abandon a game which they (hopefully) enjoyed...just because of character slot seems too extreme for me. But I understand their side of view and respect their decision.

So, after all, I guess polls regarding your thoughts about 6 character slots will suit better for this thread overall.

Raif · Mar 09, 2006, 10:08 AM // 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mandy Memory

Almost. All of pvp and 95% of pve are happy with 6. The other 5% wants 8.

ROFL - damn actually fell off chair at work and everyone is looking at me

sorry it isnt April Fools yet. somehow i think those %'s are a little hopeful, ever thought of campaigning on George Bush's behalf?

Rayea · Mar 09, 2006, 12:58 PM // 12:58

well, Hanok...

im glad you managed to get some sort of direct'ish answer out of them ^^

In brief:
1) Merged accounts will allow all slots/professions access to both worlds.
2) Only ascended characters will be able to travel by boat to each world (thereby assuming some sort of ascension quest for the Factions-born characters)
3) Players will have their choice of which world the characters will be "born" into (i.e. you can have your new Rt start in the tutorial of Cantha or in the tutorial of Tyria).
4) No new content or major changes are planned for Chapter 1 at this point.

(quoted by hand from hanok's post, since i am still learning the ropes of forum writing lol)

so it looks like i was right all along about both accension for ALL charaters, even those from other chapters....(refuses to be smug..this just means that those of us that were going to make a wa/* to make it thru ththe next chapter because we assumed something like this was in the offing, will be joined by hordes of players who realise they *have* to make a FotM char to pass the accention test....or pay someone to run them thru the parts theyt cannot do alone)

and to the players making Canthan Born assassins, but moving them to Tyria....i think they (a-net) have not realised that some few players will make ass/rit char and think of moving them to pre-searing.....
i beleave they are assuming that most people will take the two new classess as secondary or primarys, while taking a Core6 along with it...
which of course, means that they will only get the core stuff in pre searing....

which sounds to be held up by the no4 post...no new content for prophecies...

WasAGuest · Mar 09, 2006, 01:59 PM // 13:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mandy Memory

Almost. All of pvp and 95% of pve are happy with 6. The other 5% wants 8.

lol - I can do this too (make up figures).

99% of PvE want 8 slots and the rest are happy with 6.

See?

Problem here though, is I'm probably closer to the actually numbers. How so? Do a tell in common channel and see what answers you get. I was doing that yesterday and not a single person that answered said they didn't or wouldn't want 8 slots.

Seriously, majority want 8 slots. If you are a player that doesn't use all 6 or have no desire for 8, great. But there are those of us who wish to have that many. I don't understand the mentality of others who wish to "lessen" the game for other people. If some people will have more fun with 8 over 6, then why stand in thier way and "work" on making thier request come about? 8 slots takes nothing from anyone; but, it does give something to everyone.
So, come on, if you don't want the 8 slots, leave it be and stop trying to lessen the game for others. This request doesn't upset balance in any way shape or form. It simply allows players (with too much time - like me

) to play all the primary classes without deleting one I already like and enjoy so much.

Mordakai · Mar 09, 2006, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by WasAGuest

lol - I can do this too (make up figures).

99% of PvE want 8 slots and the rest are happy with 6.

See?

Problem here though, is I'm probably closer to the actually numbers. How so? Do a tell in common channel and see what answers you get. I was doing that yesterday and not a single person that answered said they didn't or wouldn't want 8 slots.

Of course not. Nobody here has said they would refuse more slots.

The question you should have asked was: are you NOT buying Factions because of the number of slots?

That's the relevant question here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WasAGuest

So, come on, if you don't want the 8 slots, leave it be and stop trying to lessen the game for others. This request doesn't upset balance in any way shape or form. It simply allows players (with too much time - like me

) to play all the primary classes without deleting one I already like and enjoy so much.

I'm not trying to "lessen the game for others." I'm trying to explain to people why Anet can't give 4 slots by merging Factions (bad precedence), while also exploring other ideas how Anet can give people what they want.

hinhtan · Mar 09, 2006, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

I'm not trying to "lessen the game for others." I'm trying to explain to people why Anet can't give 4 slots by merging Factions (bad precedence), while also exploring other ideas how Anet can give people what they want.

We only need to post our idea, and even Gaile is trying to avoid the real explaination to this issue.. Unless you are a friend of developers who knows what they are thinking....

Mordakai · Mar 09, 2006, 03:32 PM // 15:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by hinhtan

We only need to post our idea, and even Gaile is trying to avoid the real explaination to this issue.. Unless you are a friend of developers who knows what they are thinking....

lol, I wish.

No, I'm afraid it's just common sense. They can't give 4 slots by merging, because then they'll have to give 4 slots with every expansion (because some people won't buy GW until Chapter 5, 6 or later. And then they'll be pissed that Chapter "x" doesn't have 4 slots when linked....)

I am disappointed that the CE of Factions appears not to have any additional 3rd bonus slot... I thought that would make everyone happy.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...129182&page=20

Loviatar · Mar 09, 2006, 03:55 PM // 15:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rayea

so it looks like i was right all along about both accension for ALL charaters, even those from other chapters....(refuses to be smug..this just means that those of us that were going to make a wa/* to make it thru ththe next chapter because we assumed something like this was in the offing, will be joined by hordes of players who realise they *have* to make a FotM char to pass the accention test....or pay someone to run them thru the parts theyt cannot do alone)

...

HI

WITH CHEER FOR ALL I OFFICIALLY POP YOUR BUBBLE

ascention is reaching level 20 not passing the trials.

remember when a level 3 could ascend (REACH LEVEL 20) at 1 shot?

ascention trials are not account based so what about the rest of your classes that would be stuck?

HERE IS THE OFFICIAL WORD FROM ALEX WEEKES ON THIS

Quote:

Guild Wars, in contrast, is based around your skill as a player. Our maximum level is twenty and you hit that very quickly, after about 20-30 hours of play. ,We call that 'The Point of Ascension'. Almost all of the content in the game and in the future Chapters is only available to Ascended characters, which means we don't have to worry about providing different levels of content. All the good stuff will be available to everyone. It's not our intent to force people onto the levelling up treadmill, so the level cap in Guild Wars is almost meaningless.

bold is to show level 20 and not need to pass trials as well

breath big sigh of relief

why would they make so many people mad by putting that monster in their way?

Mordakai · Mar 09, 2006, 04:20 PM // 16:20

I mean, technically, do you have to pass the Ascension mission to even finish the game?

Can't you get run to Droks?

Loviatar · Mar 09, 2006, 04:30 PM // 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

I mean, technically, do you have to pass the Ascension mission to even finish the game?

Can't you get run to Droks?

aside from getting the 2 15 point quests i see no need for ascending as you can indeed be run to Droks.

if they meant to force the ascention quests on you there would be no way to avoid them.

FrogDevourer · Mar 09, 2006, 05:39 PM // 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanok Odbrook

Certainly, those players who would buy multiple accounts just to have increased character slots and storage would not necessarily need additional accounts to serve their purposes with enough supplied on a single account. However, in the end, many players (such as myself) would buy an extra account regardless, since the overall cost of playing GW is cheaper than any other MMO, and some of us still will never have enough storage space, no matter how many character slots we're given

That's precisely what I don't understand in ANet's policy.

The only understanbable and relevant argument left in my book (in favour of the 4+2) is indeed GW sales. Sure, I understand that this marketting trick is a good way to make hardcore players buy two GW:F for their two GW:P accounts. When chapter 3 hits the shelves, same hardcore players might even want to buy a couple of copies again. On the contrary, if accounts can be merged, or if slots can be added, the same players would buy only *one* copy of subsequent chapters.

Yet I fail to understand how it will significantly increase GW sales. As mentioned many times in this thread, GW is mostly aimed at casual players who do not need nor want two accounts. An indecently large amount of GW copies are sold to chinese farmers and bot users. Those need multiple copies of each chapter anyway: multiple accounts to bypass bot detection scans, and each chapter to access the latest exploitable areas. So the 4+2 policy only affects a minority of hardcore players. Most of them won't bother buying two copies of each chapter. Epinephrine explained why. They can be hardcore, but their time is limited. They'll keep their old account, but it won't be updated (at least not every 6 months). And veteran players who want more options like I do, will just buy accounts from ebay instead of chapters from ANet. They'll be able to buy the profession they need, in the chapter they need. In short, this marketting trick affects only a small minority of players. Only a few of them will buy the extra copies expected. The 4+2 will assuredly not affect GW sales enough to use such an obvious trick.

Furthermore, they'll lose an equivalent amount of money from "casual to hardcore" players, who could want to buy (optional) luxury slots or flexibility options and who are buying them on ebay. I'd be curious to read a serious and honest input from ANet about this topic. So, I wonder: flawed design from ANet or bad marketting constraint from NCSoft?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

It is a fact that PvE characters have advantages in PvP: switching out armor, multiple weapons, unique items not available at PvP creation.

Sigh. Then I wonder why PvP players are using PvP characters by a large majority. For the records, PvP characters can benefit from any PvE item farmed or bought on ebay. Even the most competitive players willing to grind for hundreds of hours (to unlock the same skills on three different PvE characters) need only a warrior, a ranger and an assassin to benefit from reusable customized weapons. The only exception to this rule are the armors. Using multiple armors in combat is marginal to say the least. Even the most broken piece of armor (the HoD hex helm) proved that ANet updates are able to fix these erroneous pieces of equipment, and to restore the PvE/PvP equipment balance. In short, don't put the blame on PvP players to try and counter PvE players. The equipment is assuredly not a good reason to fill your character slots with PvE toons.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mandy Memory

Almost. All of pvp and 95% of pve are happy with 6. The other 5% wants 8.

I can do it too. See: "95% of forum lurkers think you pulled these numbers out of your ass. The other 5% believe you.". Sorry if it sounds a bit aggressive, but your one-liner was wrong and totally irrelevant. Like all your other posts in this discussion, it proves you didn't even take the time to read the thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

Nobody here has said they would refuse more slots.

There are twenty pages of discussion. Half of those are trying to justify ANet's choice. Unless they are all playing the devil's advocate or just fanboys, I think they don't care about the number of slots. Would they pass on free slots? Probably not, but WasAGuest's point is still valid. To be honest, it's still valid since page 10 (post #231).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

The question you should have asked was: are you NOT buying Factions because of the number of slots?
That's the relevant question here.

Err no... That's called a straw man. Of course a large majority of player who like the game will buy chapter 2. Of course only a small minority is concerned by slots, and only a minority of this minority will post in fansite forums, and only a tiny minority of this minority will ragequit. That's obviously not the relevant issue to address here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

I'm not trying to "lessen the game for others." I'm trying to explain to people why Anet can't give 4 slots by merging Factions (bad precedence), while also exploring other ideas how Anet can give people what they want.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

No, I'm afraid it's just common sense. They can't give 4 slots by merging, because then they'll have to give 4 slots with every expansion (because some people won't buy GW until Chapter 5, 6 or later. And then they'll be pissed that Chapter "x" doesn't have 4 slots when linked....)

You've already used this irrelevant argument on page 8. As far as I know, it's still wrong (at least) since this post. Arguing to the point of nausea will convince only yourself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

ascention is reaching level 20 not passing the trials.

Chewbacca Defense for the win, eh? Irrelevant as it may be, the post-doppelganger cinematics features Glint's voice saying you've ascended, doesn't it? Now I'm sure you can explain the link with character slots.

crimsonfilms · Mar 09, 2006, 06:10 PM // 18:10

Bottom line

There is NO reason for ANet to limit the slots. Only reasonable one I can think of is for financial gains (more copy sold). I might be wrong, but they have not clarified.

Any number crunching you do to try to justify 6 slots is silly. Any BENEFIT of it is purely on ANets side.

Is it enough? For some, but for many it is not. Trying to make them fit to your gameplay is illogical and moot.

Any MMO/CORPG/MMORPG/etc have this limt? I am curious.

Gli · Mar 09, 2006, 06:12 PM // 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

HI

WITH CHEER FOR ALL I OFFICIALLY POP YOUR BUBBLE

ascention is reaching level 20 not passing the trials.

remember when a level 3 could ascend (REACH LEVEL 20) at 1 shot?

ascention trials are not account based so what about the rest of your classes that would be stuck?

breath big sigh of relief

why would they make so many people mad by putting that monster in their way?

The avatars of Grenth and Balthazar at the Temple of the Ages remain unconvinced that level 20 is enough to be considered ascended. Maybe the ship captains will follow their line of reasoning.

Loviatar · Mar 09, 2006, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrogDevourer

Chewbacca Defense for the win, eh? Irrelevant as it may be, the post-doppelganger cinematics features Glint's voice saying you've ascended, doesn't it? Now I'm sure you can explain the link with character slots.

hi frog

it is irrevalent to the topic but was relevant to a valid concern.

several points on this Glint not withstanding.

if Alex Weekes is right reaching level 20 is considered ascended for the purpose of continuing on.

note that you will pay a 30 attribute point penalty for not doing the 3 ascention which is a stiff penalty.

you leave from Lions Arch and not that ship off the coast at Droks for another point.

if the full ascention was needed they would have closed off the run to Droks and FORCED people to do the desert quests or else (and lost half of the casual players they want)

so Alex says this, you leave from LA and it is for casual gamers most of whom would have great trouble getting all of their different classes through it.

we will see what it turns out to be but i see a great loss of players if they are forced to be run through those missions or do them personally just to play the new chapter.

AND HOW WILL THE CHAPTER 2 PLAYERS ASSCEND AS WELL?

I STILL THINK ALEX WAS CORRECT

Mordakai · Mar 09, 2006, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrogDevourer

Sigh. Then I wonder why PvP players are using PvP characters by a large majority. For the records, PvP characters can benefit from any PvE item farmed or bought on ebay. Even the most competitive players willing to grind for hundreds of hours (to unlock the same skills on three different PvE characters) need only a warrior, a ranger and an assassin to benefit from reusable customized weapons. The only exception to this rule are the armors. Using multiple armors in combat is marginal to say the least. Even the most broken piece of armor (the HoD hex helm) proved that ANet updates are able to fix these erroneous pieces of equipment, and to restore the PvE/PvP equipment balance. In short, don't put the blame on PvP players to try and counter PvE players. The equipment is assuredly not a good reason to fill your character slots with PvE toons.

I would guess most players use PvP slots for the same reason I do: They don't have max equip, they want to try new builds without taking a Character all the way to level 20, or they want to use skills that they don't have access to. (There's probably more reasons than this, even).

My point was not to blame PvPers, my point was a counter to someone's argument that this is just a PvE vs PvP point. I believe you agree with me, Frog, since from what I understand you want 6 slots plus extra "trial" slots that:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frog

These trial slots would be usable either as PvP slots with a tiny amount of storage, or as special PvE characters you can reroll like PvP ones. The PvE trial characters would have access to all the stuff and places you've unlocked in PvE, but they would be drastically limited: minimal storage, and unable to gain XP or loot. They would be great to have the same options as in PvP, and the drastic limitation would shut down the most vehement arguments against them.

I think that's a great idea, and I don't recall ever saying it wasn't.

And I haven't given up that Anet is reading these threads and considering ideas like this.

pigdestroyer · Mar 09, 2006, 07:30 PM // 19:30

why do people keep complaining about slots.... youre not going to get 8 slots get over it

Kool Pajamas · Mar 09, 2006, 07:54 PM // 19:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by pigdestroyer

why do people keep complaining about slots.... youre not going to get 8 slots get over it

The same reason we complain about the way trade is and many other things. We want a better game.

The real problem is that Prophecies did not come with enough slots. Having more slots would be better for everyone. Even the pvp players. With more slots more people would be willing to play more professions. As is, many people make 3 or 4 professions and dont play the others or only play them very little. They dont have the experience to play the others well. If more people had the experience of playing all the professions, then it would be easier to get groups together to do quests or GvG battles or Heroes Ascent.

The only reason I see for Anet to limit the slots the way they are now is to make people buy extra accounts. If this is the reason then they should make available more slots for purchase.

They could have "expansion packs" that all they would do is increase the amount of slots on your account. I dont see why this is so hard to do. It would work the same way as linking another chapter but you are not getting anymore content, just additional slots.

BellyFlop · Mar 09, 2006, 10:50 PM // 22:50

nn

CKaz · Mar 09, 2006, 10:56 PM // 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrogDevourer

But if ANet is reading this thread and still considering this option, I guess it's important to point out that many players would be eager to buy a collector edition for this nifty extra slot.

That's pretty much my last hope, I had decided I could squeak by on 3 linked.
So if they did that it'd be CE or bust for me. Or just bust

Although Gaile seems to suggest to the negative other international threads on the subject speak to the positive (unless someone is having a bit of fun). And wouldn't that be a kick if the bonus was only in other foreign markets!

Then we raid ANet and take out their ghostly hero once and for all!

Mandy Memory · Mar 09, 2006, 11:05 PM // 23:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by V-Dragon and everyone else

Lol, 95% of PVE are happy with 6 slots? I don't think so...

Well there seem to be around 6 people posting in this thread repeatedly...6 / 2 million = ...

Everyone Ive heard in game has been excited about 2 new slots. Not complaining about only 2 new slots.

So dont discount my numbers as they are what I have observed...